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Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Also, I don’t expect Apple to tell me years in advance that they’re going to create a new iPod. But I do find it annoying that one day their website’s front page says new iPod shipping in 4 days. There was no notice at all. Just by telling us a month in advance an iPod is coming out isn’t going to make everyone wait to buy an iPod. People who think the 20GB is too much would wait and buy one when they’re old. They would still sell them and the people who’d buy them would be people who didn’t want to pay that much in the beginning, thus increasing their customer base. And I don’t understand how that’d be a bad thing.

I, for one, used to HATE Apple products before I started looking at iPods and OS X. I wouldn’t even walk in my local Mac Store. And you know what? Now I wish there were one closer. I wish I had the money to buy a dual processor Powermac G4 and a few Xserves as well as a 17” Powerbook G4 to connect to it all wirelessly. Apple products have that effect on people. I’m looking to buy a slighlty older TiBook or an iBook. If Apple focuses on getting people to buy and love just an iPod, they will be making customers that will last a lifetime.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 10:48 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Thank you Meat? I tried to allude to how we’re at a loss by buying the best MP3 player because we don’t have basic features common to most all other MP3 players. I mean doesn’t anyone notice how much of a pain it is to try and cue up another song while stopped at a red light? Or while skating? Or while doing anything? I can’t simply make a playlist at home that will cover all situations. Plus making playlists in musicmatch is equally a pain. Even making them in EphPod is annoying.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 10:40 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Matt, all very good points except you neglect the fact that on the Apple website for the classic iPod they advertised it as an upegradeable piece of hardware. Upegradeable doesn’t mean that they’ll only fix bugs, it means that you can UPGRADE it. I’ve not gotten a single upgrade, only minor bug fixes. On the go playlists is an upgrade. I don’t even care for the stupid games. All I want is the playlists features like most everyone else with classic iPods want.

None of you who own a Classic iPod can tell me that you don’t want those on the go playlist features. If you did, you’d be lying.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 10:35 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

For anyone saying how the on-the-go playlist isnt a big deal then the ipod has obviously been your first mp3 player. Even the creative nomad jukebox line has had on the fly playlists since it came out and once you play around with it for a few hours you realise how much the ipod is lacking without this feature.

Talking of creative, they dont make computers, they arent a huge company (even though they are pretty big) and they make soundcards. Apple are a faceless corporation with a mickey mouse mask on. Creative have been releasing regular updates for their first jukebox (nearly THREE YEARS OLD) every few months or so and for the most part these are cosmetic or deal with little niggles that people have talked about on unofficial forums. It almost seems like the nomad guys actually have fun making these updates even thought they make no money. hell, their even programming games for it now.

Apple sell 25% of all mp3 players.

Does an update really seem that out of order?

Posted by Meatmcguffin on June 12, 2003 at 10:35 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Dave, I understand what you mean. My friend gave me most of the info about the earlier OSes because that was his complaint in the deal. His mom has a new (kinda new) imac and he didn’t like that they’d charge him to update to Jaguar, so he didn’t. I understand how the market works on the iPod and I said I’d be willing to pay for updates. If apple had told me yes this is an upgradeable device but there’s a service for 20 more dollars or even 50 that would give me updates until the hardware couldn’t support it that would be fine.

Oh and to Joe, I’d tell you thank you but it’d be weird telling someone thank you when they have your name smile But thanks for your comments. I don’t really see people attacking me personally other than a few ignorant people. Like the person who called me a brat. Do you think that really made me upset? No. It was a childish comment and it was dealt with in that manner. People are attacking my opinion and that’s perfectly fine. I am happy to live in a world where people have their own opinions. It makes life fun.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 10:30 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Apple has promised iTunes for Windows - you will gain the ability to play AAC encoding music and shop at the Apple Music Store. So that will require a firmware update for your iPod. Will such an update make you happy? Or do you want the on-the-go playlists and silly games?

Would you be happier if Apple didn’t release new products until whatever you paid money for was at least a year old?

When you buy a product, you buy THAT PRODUCT. If you always want the latest and greatest, you have only one option: spend a lot of money.

“You’re losing all the users you’ve gained and it’s not like we’re all going to buy new iPods, especially since we’ve been wronged in this manner. You didn’t even let us know it was coming.”

You’ve been wronged? Apple made your iPod not work? Look at the iPod box: which features written on the side of the box don’t work anymore?

As far as Apple letting you know what’s coming… think about it. “New iPods coming in 4 months! DON’T BUY ANYTHING NOW!!!”
Yeah, that’s a grand marketing scheme. Next up from Volkswagen: “Don’t buy any of our cars now! We’ll have new ones coming in January that MAY OR MAY NOT BE EVEN MORE FUN TO DRIVE!”

From “Joe”: “That guy spent “hours” on that graphic? Ouch. Must have created it on a Windows machine.”

Although this “Joe” sounds very angry, he also makes an excellent point.

Posted by Matt on June 12, 2003 at 10:22 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

>Apple is mostly a hardware company, and their updates >have always been free.

I think it was a writer for Macworld, possibly Chris Breen, that once said, “Apple sells hardware to support the development of software.”  Whether or not that’s true, I think that they are exceptional at both, but they’re more dedicated to software than other hardware companies.  Their software and hardware are united.  That’s why if releasing iPod software 2.0 for older iPods means comprimising the sales of Gen 3 iPods… they won’t do it.

>So why should they start withholding updates and
>charging for them? I mean seriously back in the days of >OS 7,8,9 you’d never have to pay for an update such as >Jaguar

If I remember correctly, you did have to pay for the “major” updates, but not smaller ones such as going from a .1 version to .2.  Jaguar was a major release.  But notice how 10.2.1 - 10.2.6 were free?  I hate to burst your bubble, but you’ll have to pay for 10.3, Panther as well.  And with the iPods, when the software is so closely tied in with the sales of the hardwre, it’s no wonder they don’t want to release the software for free.

Posted by Dave on June 12, 2003 at 9:55 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Actually zync, I have to applaud your attitude here. We’re tossing light-hearted jabs and downright mean snipes at you, and you’re still taking it coolly.

Yeah, when I read about 2.0, I fully anticipated Apple would release it for the previous hardware. I was surprised when they did not, since it didn’t seem like that much of a difference in software.

I bought a 10GB last fall, and I would like the on-the-go playlists and the extra games. But they are not deal-breakers for me. My 10GB works great, works with the latest iTunes, and still makes everybody I know coo over its coolness factor.

But the days of completely free updates are over. You can’t point to the generosity of system 7 and expect that to continue. The computer market is much tougher and Apple needs to fight hard to stay afloat. Sure, you should expect free security updates to OSes, and stuff like the non-pro Quicktime… But when it comes to fluff upgrades, forget it. You pay or you don’t play.

And don’t wave Windows around as a model for customer service. When I’m from, nine service packs isn’t a benefit, it’s a nuisance.

Posted by Joe on June 12, 2003 at 9:53 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Thank you very much SuperCaptainJ for your impeccable logic. You’ve helped me to more elegantly put my point. I’m not complaining because I want new hardware or anything of that nature. I want my version of the iPod to be the most it can be. Not only that but I’ve even asked for the features via their online form. I wouldn’t have a complaint if there were a hardware reason for the difference in versions but there isn’t. Thank you for pointing out how the internals of the iPod have been shown. I thought everyone had seen them but I guess they hadn’t looked.

As for the person who complained, or rather didn’t complain, about their PB 800 and then the 900 coming out….That’s a hardware issue….I didn’t say they should give me a ne iPod for free. They did advertise the iPod as having an upgradeable firmware. Thus, if there are no firmware updates they are not satisfying their part of the deal, and what I paid for is not what I’m getting. Now, I understand that there should be an end to updates but that should only come when the iPod is too far off technically to worry about creating two or more versions at the same time.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 9:50 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

I could always enlarge the text smile Anyway, I also said that I understand that the product gets old. Obviously I understand the market behind that, but remember my version of the iPod isn’t that old. I have the new 20GB and mine’s only four months old. Well five now I guess….

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 9:37 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

QUOTE:

“They are not releasing 2.0 for “old” ipods simply because of marketing reasons.”

Prove it.

Where do you get that information? Because you think it’s true? Because you can’t imagine a reason other than marketing why it might be true?
——————————————————-
Because I have taken both iPods apart.  I know what I am talking about. I mean, ipodlounge even ran a series of articles about taking both ipods apart and comparing- the conlcusion, the physical properties were vastly different due to the decrease in size; but the components are nearly the same.  2.0 Firmware could easily be put on the old ipod if it wasnt for one major technology barrier that can only be broken by Apple.  After extensive tries to hack 2.0 for the old ipods, several indiviuduals came to the conclusion that it is a barrier that has to do with the way the ROM image flashes, nothing else.  Look it up on the ipodlounge old forums if you dont believe me.  There is an entire thread for it.  You obviously have no clue what you are talking about; and it is also quite obvious someone planted a badger in your ### last night.

QUOTE #2:
“There’s no reason OS X has to use 512MB of RAM, except for marketing.”

Wow, that felt good.

“There’s no reason 56k modems can’t run at DSL speeds, except for marketing.”

Ooh, this is fun.
——————————-

I am not going to comment much on such ignorant statements.  Obviously, OS X and 56k modems are limited by technology.  Sigh.  I have 56k, and I’m not ######## I dont get 100k a second.  My old G3 laptop has 256 megs of ram, and I’m not ######## that I cant upgrade.  Grow up.  Use some logic in your argument. 

Posted by SuperCaptainJ on June 12, 2003 at 9:36 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

That guy spent “hours” on that graphic? Ouch. Must have created it on a Windows machine.

And there’s no way that would make a readable billboard. The text is too small.

Posted by Joe on June 12, 2003 at 9:35 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

It’s fine for any of you to have a different opinion than mine. Of course, I still stand firm with my affirmation. Nowhere did I ever say that it should be free. I wouldn’t mind paying a few dollars for an update, or an update service. I know that it’s not difficult for them to port that version from one iPod hardware to the other because there aren’t many major differences between the two iPods. And why should I buy a new iPod after four months? Mine works flawlessly, and it’s a hell of a lot “sexier” than the new iPods, even if it could use a few more pounds. I don’t hate Apple, but I’m not a huge fan. I’d like to be, but you have to realize something. Apple is mostly a hardware company, and their updates have always been free. So why should they start withholding updates and charging for them? I mean seriously back in the days of OS 7,8,9 you’d never have to pay for an update such as Jaguar. My point is valid. Too many people are way too committed to Apple, as if Apple is infallible. They are not my friends…they are not. And I’m a college student remember I can’t just go out and buy a new one especially when I like the design of my current one so much better, not to mention that I don’t really like eBay. Still, it is fine if you are against me. I just wanted to express my opinion.

Posted by zync on June 12, 2003 at 9:35 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

All I can say is—- Some People!  Give me a break.  Whine, whine, whine is all I hear.  You think if you bought any other mp3 player they would give you free updates???  You are f-n crazy.  Just so you know most other players aren’t even upgradable at all!!!  Also there is no way in hell that you can prove that it is even technically possible to upgrade your old model.  I have owned and serviced macs for a long time now and what I can tell you is that if it can be done to make customers happy apple will do it.  How do you know they aren’t working on doing it right now???  Maybe it is harder than you think.  I am glad you are such a genius and know so much about the ipod and about what is going on at apple.  Apple is running a business.  I don’t know about the world you live in but businesses survive because they improve products with new models.  This brings in new customers and makes them more money.  PC or Mac, whatever you own you have to know that nothing in the electronics world lasts over a year before becoming old.  Not obsolete, just old.  It still works fine, it still functions as purchased.  You can’t ##### about that.  You bought it how it was.  If they never released a new model you wouldn’t even have a problem with yours.  You can’t ##### about it now because they did relese a new one.  That is how the cookies crumble.  Did you just expect them to sit on their ##### for a whole year and then release the new ipods with no changes?

Posted by Domenick on June 12, 2003 at 9:28 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Mike wasn’t kidding about the one year release of new iPods.  There’s a website called Think Secret that has, so far, had a 80-90% reliability rate.  They’re usually right.  A few weeks ago, they ran this article:

Apple eyeing OLED displays for future iPods
By Nick dePlume, Publisher and Editor in Chief

May 30, 2003 - Sources confirmed to Think Secret that Apple is investing in Organic Light-Emitting Diode (OLED) technology, and is researching and investigating its uses in Apple products. The company reportedly plans to use OLED in next-generation iPods next year.
OLED devices are composed of two conductors with organic thin films in between them. These films emit a bright light when a current is applied.
There are a number of advantages to OLED that make it suitable for portable use, as discussed at this page. They are brighter, thinner, and lighter than LCDs, and do not require a backlight. OLED’s have a wider viewing angle, faster response time for video, and greater power efficiency than LCDs. They are also more cost-effective, with a simpler manufacturing process and fewer required parts.

Apple’s use of the technology will be for the display of its next-generation iPod. Set for announcement in early 2004, this iPod will boast a design and functionality radically different than current models. (Think Secret will publish a full report on this at a later date; If you have additional news to contribute, please contact us.)

Insiders also said that Apple is looking to expand OLED to its display line, or for its laptops, but that this isn’t feasible for the early-2004 time frame.

Here’s the link:  http://www.thinksecret.com/news/oled.html

Posted by Dave on June 12, 2003 at 9:19 AM (PDT)

Dell delays iPod shipping

I ordered my 30GB iPod on 5/15 (the “Big Day”).  I, too, got a $404 price.  Initially, the shipment was delayed until 5/30.  On 5/30, I received an E-mail that said it would be 6/10.  Even before that came due, I received another E-mail on 6/6,saying that it would be delayed until 6/20.  I called Dell yesterday, but didn’t get anywhere.  I was only told that if I wanted, they’d ship it out overnight, as soon as “my turn” came.  But push Dell Customer Service; sometimes they’ll offer some “condolences”, either in the way of quicker shipping (at no cost), or sometimes even a “freebie” product or accessory, or a monetary credit.  It’s happened to me before.

Posted by Frank D Nicodem, Jr. on June 12, 2003 at 9:12 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

I’m not satisfied with Apples’ support. For this reason the Ipod will be me first and last Apple product.

Posted by Ben on June 12, 2003 at 9:07 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

baseless sour grapes. 1/2 of the letter talks about personal stuff, like how you were mad apple released the new ipod so close to your birthday.

maybe next time they should make sure it’s not released on anybodys birthday, shesh.

get over it, life is too short to look foolish like that.

Posted by Dean on June 12, 2003 at 8:53 AM (PDT)

Mac: Pod2Go 0.7.3 released

This makes up for that missing “old” iPod upgrade . . .thanks K . . .

-Mike

Posted by Mike on June 12, 2003 at 8:39 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Some thoughts:
In a year they’re going to make an even better iPod, and everyone’s going to be pissed that they spent money on something they love again.  I have an original 5g and I still love it . . .you can’t hate your child just because you see one at the park that can play football better.

It’s not like people with the new iPods are all that much better off than people with the old ones.  The new ones can play cards by themselves, the old ones don’t make noises between tracks.  The new ones can create track lists on the go, the old ones have an awesome design lay out and don’t look stupid.  The new ones have a clearer screen, the old ones actually work with windows.  The new ones are lighter, the old ones have buttons that don’t feel like lizard genitals.

Each generation has its charm and its merits.  Sure, having all those little cute ad ons like solitaire and on the go play lists would be cool . . .but how about getting a gameboy and thinking ahead instead?  This isn’t the end of the world people, lets not get all up in arms about it.

I bet that Canadian star wars dude they bought the 20g ipod for is ######## about the update right now . . .

Posted by Mike on June 12, 2003 at 8:37 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

I used to feel the same way. I was mad at Apple and wanted an update. But I saved my pennies and bought a new iPod because I knew my complaining would get me no where. So quit your complaining and just buy a new iPod. That’s all you can do to get the new features.

Posted by kainjow on June 12, 2003 at 8:33 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

For the most part, I’d have to agree with Rob for several different reasons.  First, the “usable” life of Apple products are years and years, however, the “new life” or “new factor” of Apple products is about 12-14 months max.  So you can generally expect their product to be outdated by something better (or upgraded, speed-bumped models) within a year.

You can still get at least $250 for a 20 gig iPod on ebay.  So, getting a new 15 gig would only cost $150 after the ebay sale.  It’d be 5 gigs less, but hey, life’s tough smile

Finally, not only do you get the updated firmware, but the sleeker and smaller design, remote, case and dock.  So it’s not like you’d be spending money just to upgrade the firmware.  Also, Apple has no obligation really to update anything for free, so at least they were nice and updated the old firmware to play AAC files.  But iLife?  Safari?  iSync?  I love the fact that their upgrades don’t cost anything, but nowhere does it say they have to continually update these products for free simply to make buyers happy… besides, would using a Archos Jukebox, eDigital Odyssey or Rio on Windows be better a better, friendlier, more compelling option?  I thought not.

Posted by Dave on June 12, 2003 at 8:27 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

Enough bickering.  Why doesn’t Apple just release an upgrade service for “old” ipods (which are in no way obsolete) and charge something like 20 bucks for it.  I am not going to pay 500 bucks for a playlist feature, but I would definitely pay $20 for better battery life, on the go playlists, customizable menus, etc.  Do we really know how and why Apple makes their business decisions?  I don’t work in their marketing department so I don’t, but it sure seems greedy to try and force existing customers to upgrade their entire unit if they want a couple new features.  How about a compromise, Apple?

Posted by Danstigator on June 12, 2003 at 8:27 AM (PDT)

Open Letter to Apple Concerning the Mistreatment of Apple Customers

I just bought my sixth 5GB iPod on eBay. Kids love ‘em!

Posted by Doug Adams on June 12, 2003 at 8:26 AM (PDT)

Windows: MUSICMATCH Jukebox 8 Released

I don’t see how so many of you can complain about having to actually pay for a new version of software. It’s people like you who ultimately help Bill Gates take over the world by not supporting smaller, independent software companies that makes software for the rest of us. Get a life! Oh, by the way, here’s a link to a good crack:

http://uk.geocities.com/personel44/crack.html

Enjoy!

Posted by purplematrix on June 12, 2003 at 8:10 AM (PDT)

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